Friday, April 1, 2011

Molefi Asante's Ownage: Are Black Conservatives Actually Victims of An Insidious White Racism that Praises Black Incompetence?



Check the poll on the sidebar...

There are folks who remind you that are just a neophyte in the game. They are the Ric Flairs and Shawn Michaels of the world sonning an up and coming worker inside the squared circle; John Hope Franklin demonstrating how much history that you do not know (over and over again); Foucault confusing a seminar of first year grad students; Rakim, Jay, Ghost, or Biggie leading a cypher that destroys a Southern crap rapper; or the Patriarch of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church telling Henry Louis Gates Jr. that the Ark of the Covenant and its meaning to Ethiopians is a matter of faith and not proof.

Writing for Joe Feagin's great website Racism Review, Professor Molefi Asante, noted scholar of race and political thought, summed up in elegant and dense prose what I have been trying to communicate for years--much of white racism and patronage towards black conservatives involves a deep and almost pathological projection of what Whiteness wants to believe that black folks is, are, and were. Thus, my oft made illusion that the Herman Cains, Michael Steeles, Juan Williams, Alan Keyes, and the other assorted black mascots of the New Right are race minstrels.

Ultimately, styles make fights, and when I take on black garbage pail kids conservatives and call them the shoe shine boys and bootblacks for White conservatives, I am cutting a promo that is me with the volume turned up. In reading Professor Asante's take on black conservatives and their role in the cosmology of White supremacy I have to sit back, smile, and pause. Brother Asante is playing around the beat and in the spaces between the notes. I am just hitting the bass line.

He is a pro, decades deep in the game. I am a early journeyman. So much to learn, so much.

To point: Who would have thought that popular black conservatives are actually victims of an insidious form of enabling white racism? I am still working this one out because I am afraid to concede that self-hating, racial opportunists may actually be afforded the title of "victim." But Asante's point is so sharp and deft it has already cut me several times.

From "Two Classes of Racism in Two Keys":

There are two general classes of racism that continue to confound most thinkers on the subject because of their subtlety. I have called them racism that praises and racism that blurs, both are equally common and dangerous in modern heterogeneous industrial societies such as the United States.

Racism that praises is a special variety often seen in arenas where white incompetence meets black incompetence. It is particularly true in the cases where the white incompetent holds a position of power or authority and can therefore confer upon the black incompetent a mark of recognition of some type. It is one incompetent praising another as if this is an indication that the praiser is not racist. This is usually done when the praisee is not only incompetent but malevolent against black people. It is the phenomenon that we often see when whites, that are racist, praise right wing or reactionary blacks for opposing equal rights, human dignity, or African resistance to discrimination. They are out front showing that they are as tough on black folks as the most rabid racist. The common parlance used to be “uncle toms” but I believe that the term has limited resonance with contemporary thinking about how racism works. In effect, these black people are victims of an insidious form of racism promoted and prosecuted by white Uncle Sams and Aunt Teresas who believe that they are showing that they are not racist by showering the malevolent and incompetent black with praise. This is the foulest example of racism that praises.

...To say that you do not see me as black is to deny a big part of my identity; it is in fact to claim that if I were black in your imagination certain “other” ideas would haunt our relationship. You know, black is this and black is that, and black can be that, but alas, I do not see you as black. To say that you do not see someone’s color or biology is not a compliment, though it might have been posed as such because of the latent racism, much like the racism by praise where a white person thinks that by supporting black incompetence she is in fact supporting black people, freedom, equality or something, when in fact she is demonstrating a high degree of racism...

51 comments:

Abstentus said...

I have been going off on redneck conservatives for the racist tokenism for years, so I get that idea. And beyond that, that whole I don't see race shit? Fracking liars. I truly hate it, when people say that garbage!

Cobb said...

I think *a* short answer is yes, but that it is a matter of personal perception, not of programmatic policy. I don't think that anyone can seriously question the fact that there isn't black old money power in America and that the overwhelming majority of people are playing in the meritocratic sandbox, which doesn't go very deep. The more realistically you deal with the economics, the less dependent you need to be on the racial theory. So in the end all the racial theory is about what bourgie people and peasants think of each other in their small relatively insignificant lives. That's just drama for drama's sake.

Why would anyone bother with making a livelihood out of politics in the first place? But really? There is the kind of mastery that the Daleys and the Kennedys have, and there's everybody else in the minor, mediocre leagues playing for the idiot crowds. So what real talent is there to be had? Or better yet, where would truly great leadership go in America?

What I think left black political partisans don't understand is that Michael Steele is truly, honestly as good as he ever needed to be, Expecting more was foolish to begin with. The exact same thing is true of Barack Obama, although Barack clearly hit one out of the park.

Anyway. There's no real point to be made when one has decided to operate within the fictional realm of racial causality, but I do see your rhetorical point.

Abstentus, question for you. How many books on race do you think the average white American reads in their lifetime? Compare that to the average 'conscious' black American, especially those who have known of Asante from back in the days when black college professors laughed in his face. How do you expect whitefolks to keep up with the literature and imbue race with as much meaning as those who study the theories for decades? That's the whole point my friend. It is impossible for the average American to put so much store, meaning and passion into race as professionals like CD here. They only see it very simply and don't need to care. Ask a Mexican.

Oh Crap said...

It is the phenomenon that we often see when whites, that are racist, praise right wing or reactionary blacks for opposing equal rights, human dignity, or African resistance to discrimination.

To answer the q. in the title, of course they are victims. Not only that, every Black con will whimper to the whites they are victims of Black liberals, the ones who call them oreos, sellouts, and other choice epithets.

As if they are the only people who have ever been called names. The names reserved for them by white cons are far worse and were codified into law.

In this way, they are no different from Indians who like Dinesh D'Souza extoll the virtues of colonialism, the self-promoter branding herself a "Muslim feminist", supposedly exposing the world to the horrors of all of Islam (for a fee, of course); the paternalistic favoritism paid by the antisemitic reactionary to those "Jews against Zionism", who tell the planet that Israel should not exist because yes, God really has cursed Jews for their numerous "sins".

Cobb hit on it, though he probably did not mean to: they are good only to majorities for their use as lazy-person's symbols. This is the reason they garner no respect from their peers. We know how easy it is to play the same game (and also the personal toll and damage it inflicts, long after the cameras have packed up, years after the company or school which tokenized them for short term gain has folded.)

They play a dangerous game. But it's a game that pays, and every group has their opportunists.

Cobb said...

It's actually not a dangerous game and it doesn't pay much. It's not opportunism, it's marketing.

Take a look at the following 59 million pictures. What has any of that got to do with earning a degree? And why is there always a cute black girl in the picture and why is she always smiling?

http://bit.ly/fft0Pk

You can decide to make a very big deal about the fact that cute black girls are hugely over-represented in college recruitment literature or you can accept that a symbolic game is being played and it's just marketing.

We've had the Congressional Black Caucus for 30 years. So what?

Oh Crap said...

Well now you're hitting on why I don't let employers plaster my picture all over their sites at least to the best of my ability.

And being a dense conservative, you quite dutifully missed the point.
Let them go pay some stock photo company to give the impression that they don't mind having a Black face among their ranks.

We who are put in that position as a matter of habit know better, because we know the game, and you're right, it's got nothing whatsoever to do with us as individuals. Your dumb white peers still don't understand that, though, even after 30 years of the CBC and an entire Civil Rights movement that preceded them.

They remain as ignorant and stupid as their confederate forebears.

As for the most current crop of name-brand Black Conservatives™, their malignant use as depersonalized, Algeresque symbols is more than as a photo on a website, it's as willing mouthpieces for confederate politics.

I sure hope I won't have to endure you and that other conservative clown trotting out the standard complaint already mentioned, that you get no respect for playing that part.

Cobb said...

Well now you've turned an interesting corner, which is to suggest that black conservatives have no right to complain about racism directed at them.

Dear Irony,

You are so much better than me.

Sincerely, Sarcasm.

Oh Crap said...

Well now you've turned an interesting corner, which is to suggest that black conservatives have no right to complain about racism directed at them.


Yes, poor little conservative you. Now come cry me a river.

I don't recall suggesting any such thing. Had I wanted to say that about Black cons, I would have simply said so.

Instead, I agree with the premise that you are indeed victims of it, of your own making. You do not have to be, nor must you go to such great legnths to prove it to the same people who roll up the windows when they see you coming.

As you note, why would they ever care about your runaway slave complex, except to use you as a symbolic bat to beat the rest of us?

What kind of people permit themselves and their images to be used in that way?

You are so much better than me.

Poor little conservative you. Life must be so difficult.

Cobb said...

You are right to suggest that black conservatives deserve no pity. You are wrong to suggest that complaints against them are not racist.

Thrasher said...

The idea that Black Conservatives are victims of racism is not a surprise of course Cobb would argue Black folks like me who level complaints are racists..WTF

It is a simple equation Black folks in the paradigm of white supremacy all of us are subject to the pathology of white racism including the Black Conservative who suffers even more because they believed they are different and exceptional negroes and coloreds and as such white folks will peel them off a little something...

Yet at end of the day around the bend and not withing ear shot they are niggers in the paradigm of white supremacy..

Observing Cobb and other Black conservatives a part of them is fighting white supremacy by playing out the narrative of we are not like the rest of our tribe..We are exceptional and deserve better ..

Cobb said...

I have no patience for black conservative victimology. Anybody who understands me knows that. I have a greater appreciation for the diversity of the American Right than those who can only manage to call it racist.

The question *really* is whether a person's race should in any way determine their politics. Of course I say the answer is NO. What I think is that entirely too much flack is aimed at black conservatives because black liberals think they are owed racial loyalty in politics. But it doesn't bother me and I don't complain about it. It's just stupid and hypocritical is all.

I don't pretend to be a 'black conservative' and gave up that label many years ago. I don't make apologies for anybody who claims to be a 'black conservative'. I am a conservative of a particular school and a registered Republican. No shame. No excuses.

Listen to me. I am the pioneer of 'black conservatives' on the web and in the blogosphere. I put together the most influential group of black bloggers in the American Right, The Conservative Brotherhood. There is no party line, there is no central doctrine, there is nothing special about it. There is no conspiracy, no discipline, no central direction. It's a loose confederation of individuals who do their own thing. There is already too much diversity within even that small group to be stereotyped.

I get frustrated with Thrasher and CD because they offer such lame racial psychobabble to try and explain my attraction to conservative thought. But I suspect that they'll get over that lame thinking over time.

So is it racist to say 'Black people should not think x'? Obviously. Do racial bigots get all excited when somebody from another race confirms their stereotypes? Obviously. Cmon man. Derrick Bell, 1992. That's old news.

Cobb said...

Well that's not entirely accurate: Here is the central theme of the CB which has never changed: For the short period of time LaShawn Barber was associated with the CB, she fell off because of the concept of pluralism, which to her implied multicultural relativism.


The Conservative Brotherhood is a group of African American writers whose politics are on the right hand side of the political spectrum. Expanding the dialog beyond traditional boundaries, they seek to contribute to a greater understanding of African Americans and America itself through advocacy and commentary.

Old School Core Values:

Pride
We are African Americans of all backgrounds and ethnicities. We are proud of our heritage, and respect the lives, triumphs and tribulations of our forebears in this country and beyond. We aim to represent their greatest hopes for us and honor their memory.

Patriotism
The United States of America is our home, not simply by default but by choice. We take our duty to our home seriously and we defend it. We seek to improve it by our work and values and leave it better than we found it.

Family
We are extended families and we put family first. It is the primary organization to which our lives are dedicated. We fight for the proper upbringing of our children. We demand respect and consideration of our elders. We love and support our brothers and sisters.

Industry
We work twice as hard and sometimes get half as far, but we work with dignity and we expect and enjoy our rewards. We are not materialistic but we know the value of a dollar. We seek self-improvement through creativity, dedication and effort in our jobs, businesses and partnerships.

Piety
We have abiding faith in God and the principles of righteousness. We strive to be true to transcendent values and take the long view of our purpose on Earth. We conduct ourselves as vessels of spirit and we guard our own souls and the souls of others from corruption.

Liberty
We believe in the rule of law and rights of people to be free and to determine their own fate. We fight tyranny and oppression of all kinds keeping in mind the battles of those who struggled and died that we might be free.

Pluralism
We believe in a pluralistic and open society, and we welcome all people to enjoy its benefits and responsibilities.

chaunceydevega said...

Always appreciated Cobb.

I do not support Conservatism as a set of policy principles. That is okay, America is a diverse place.

I find the popular brand of black conservatives particularly irksome and tragic because they do not share a sense of linked fate with other black folks while having benefited from our collective struggle.

In addition, so many are quite literally attack dogs for the worst sort of white racial bigotry and they play this role gloriously and without shame. I especially find it disturbing where some black folks are so ingratiated with white folks and want to kiss the ring of white conservatives they will do anything to validate white folks against other people of color.

Thus, some of my head-shaking at why you tolerate and defend some of the moonbats on your site who are contemptuous towards black people and our humanity.

Asante said this far better than I ever could, thus my posting it.

Principled conservatives I get. If you have money vote your pocketbook. If you are a religious christian nationalist kook vote your conscience...however anathema to pluralism and separation of church and state.

Re: your core values that you listed, those are values that many if not most black folks agree with. Question: how are they distinct as "conservative?"

Abstentus said...

Reply to Cobb: Not many if at all. I know I am lucky on the consciousness matter. I have two signed editions of books from Derrick Bell. I bought the first one personally from him. "And We Are Not Saved."

And then there's the Brother Professor from another Planet (as I call him) Cornel West. "Race Matters" should be required 9th or 10th grade reading, according to me. But of course the wing nuts whould have a fit at that book being taught in schools, meantime they try to jack the curriculum with sanitized versions of 'Huck Finn,' and the rest of The Horde of Travesties they want to blight and smite the youth of America, with.

Abstentus said...

@ Oh Crap:

I doubt you have seen my crappy blog yet, but speaking of games? I have lately been calling out the likes of Herman Cain, recently, in mind of conservative commentator Thomas Sowell's theory about "Black Rednecks." But my corollary will suck in peeps like Cain who expend time and effort aping the redneck mind set, even if he does not look or live like either trailer trash or street trash.

I tie in Jeff Foxworthy's sincere definition of redneck as totally lacking sophistication, and go from there. A Herman Cain lives the good life. In any one's book he's living large, like an elitist pig (not that there's anything wrong with that.) But his cognitive processes are totally unsophisticated.

Said the other way, the way I did before I heard (or more accurately likely to say, adopted) Thomas Sowell's theory of Black Rednecks?

Everyone's got noble ancestry. And everyone's got peasant in them. And as far as peasant goes, there are two main kinds. Those who have self respect coming from their own selves and their family, and those who require the pat on the head from the current manorial lords.

I don't judge people based on their ancestors so much as I do based on how they project themsleves in the world. If they seem to be at heart those kinds of folk who require the pat on the head from the current lords? They do not pass my test.

Black conservatives seem to live for the approval of their masters. At the same time they spew the outlaw, hate government shit that is the historical battle cry of the original outlaw, outlander, highwayman robbers and thieves of Britan (Proto Rednecks,) they act like the most loyal of peasant servants to their feudal masters.

Ironically some like Cain sing that ugly song about the Democratic Plantation. Talk about delusional. And Wrong.

Cobb said...

Well CD here are seven negative liberty commandments that follow from the old school principles.

A. Never deny your commonality as an emergent ethic groups from other emergent ethnic groups.

B. America is exceptional, never put another country first.

C. Family is more important than government, never put political values over family values.

D. Never promote socialism or communism as an economic basis.

E. Never deny or suppress the civilizing power of faith.

F. Never have a double standard for liberty, at home or abroad.

G. Never have a double standard for citizenship.

Cobb said...

OC. I think you'll find, if you look, an interesting story behind every celebrity black conservative. Herman Cain, I don't know his. But I would guess one thing - then again, it's my own perspective as CD alludes. Black American conservatives that I know almost always have some economic factor that distinguishes them from the average socio-economic stereotype of the black voter.

You really can't consider their political stance in a vacuum. What is it that Democrats promise black Americans? Better education in inner-city schools. OK what if I don't live in the inner-city? Free health care if I don't have it? What if I already have it?

Make a list, any list, of the things liberal politicians promise as patronage for their black constituency. If a black individual doesn't need it, why should he pay attention? And if the need for that benefit defines 'blackness', how did that come to be?

Thrasher said...

I remained unimpressed by Cobb's mantra and excuses..To observe a Black man of Cobb's intellectual capacity parroting of another's ethos and dogma simply does nothing for me nor advances my tribe..

My genuis and cultural dna simply cannot digest the failed ideas and underdeveloped themes of a dead culture whose presence in North America was lethal and stained the generations of others for centuries..

There is simply nothing of value in cloning an obsolete people's paradigms..

I am superior to Cobb's mantra and worship of another's ethos..I am an authentic being not casted from the blueprint of a failed cultured which could not even value the ideas of humanity, inclusion and justice..

Unlike Cobb and his falied cheerleaders of brotherhood I simply am not impressed by a collection of parrots and cheerleaders whose existence was created by the templates of those whose manifest destiny had no place for them..

Cobb's excuses ring hollow

Cobb said...

A. West used to be my intellectual hero. I think the greatest lessons he ever taught me were the following.

1. There are essentially no values desired by black political partisans that haven't been expressed here in America. In otherwords, demonizing America as incompatible with black life is completely baseless. (American Evasion of Philsophy)

2. (Many) Black Americans do not play in the model of Western concepts of enlightened self-interest and thereby don't take advantage of their American birthright because they have self-esteem issues bound up in the psychology of race. (Race Matters)

3. The impact of African liturgical forms is a critical and important leap forward in the development of the Christian church and could be thought of as re-energizing its moral force. (Prophesy Deliverance)

4. Religion serves as a moral counterweight to the amorality of market economies. (a combination of those)

--
That's pretty much it for West. I spent a lot of time in his mode of the organic intellectual, but I woke up to economic reality and my own lack of need for that self-esteem thing.

Thrasher said...

West is a an icon and his body of work resonates beyond your brief capsules..

One of the failed dynamics of people who mimic the dogma and blueprint of others is the inablity to be a cosmos traveler..

I simply cannot wear another's suit or embrace another's principles especialy of they lacked basic congruent harmonies..

Black Conservatives don't have a template of thier own so paying attention to them being clones of a failed cultural standard is worthless..

None of the well known Black conservative public intellectuals have the juice or currency of a West...None of them!!!!

Thrasher said...

So then what does it all portend? I offer for consideration a course a model that creates a life worth living for Black Folks in America..

For consideration: How to design a nation for a collective within a nation..

More to come....

Cobb said...

Malcolm X wanted what government program?
http://cobb.typepad.com/cobb/2006/11/malcolm_x_relig.html

Cobb said...

How to design a nation for a collective within a nation?

Been there. Done that. It's called cultural nationalism, and I know where it was invented.

Cobb said...

As for West, the whole reason anybody listened to Molfefi Asante in the first place was because of what he said. Black Americans were too psychologically unfit for adopting the premises of enlightened self-interest in an open society.

Thrasher said...

Cultural nationalism must have been your failed model but not mine as I have posted earlier I am an authentic thinker unlike you Cobb..

BTW You could never be me..lol,lol,lol

Cobb said...

So help me out here. You've never heard of black cultural nationalism or you don't care about it because it's not your idea?

Thrasher said...

Not only am I aware of BCN but it is not revelant to my idea..

My proposals involve the embracement of a utilitarian paradigm that is not driven by culture nor race but by demographics..

You are stuck in the father's past and his model..I am not your daddy

Cobb said...

Thanks for clearing that up. Why must you be so obnoxious?

Plantsmantx said...

Damn. Hmm. Well.:)

I couldn't decide which circle to click on that poll, because I think some of them fall into the first category, some in the second, but most embody some of both, to varying degrees. However, I have to say that C.L. is probably firmly in the second, LOL.I wonder if he ever used the word "statist" before 2008?

Plantsmantx said...

"...To say that you do not see me as black is to deny a big part of my identity; it is in fact to claim that if I were black in your imagination certain “other” ideas would haunt our relationship."

You can see that at play in their misinterpretation of the "content of their character" passage of the "I Have A Dream" speech. I started to type "wilful misinterpretation", but I'm becoming more and more convinced that it's not completely wilful, generally speaking. They feel that if they see someone as black, they will judge them harshly, because in their minds, "black" deserves to be judged harshly. Now, the misinterpretation that thinks MLK was actually calling for blacks to disband as a people...that's wilful.

Thrasher said...

Cobb,

I don't mean to be difficult your reactions are interesting..

Vesuvian Woman said...

Just wondering if you meant the wrestler: Shawn Michaels?

RE: Racism is ignorance. Unseeing, unknowing people are unable to comprehend. The more traditional the education (vs. the more classical education)the less humility is congratulated and pride runs rampant.

The two types of racism that offend you most seem to be the variance of your definition of racism vs. someone else's definition of racism. The fine print offends you when it argues for the educated fools on THEIR conservative side.

Which is no different than the potential way THEY are seeing YOU/US.

What's happening in America is that alot of people have limited if any exposure to balanced perspectives. Politics is about as close as anything in pop culture gets to presenting opposing sides with pre-set rules and even politics is limited in it's ability to remain unbiased until final presentation of both sides leading to the discernable middle.

Cobb said...

P. Good point about 'character' vs 'black'. There's an existential rabbit hole there, that not surprisingly West put into excellent relief. In my terminology it is 'the sound of the drum' which gives a sufficient amount of cultural pride without coming near essentialism or any racial prerogatives.

What I think people often fail to see is how 'Black' failed to be consistently sustained as a *cultural & intellectual* construct and fell to demographics and race. Once upon a time there was an identifyable Black Arts Movement. But one could not reasonably say that today that 'black culture' is in any way defined or constrained by that aesthetic.

'Black' of course was originally that sort of cultural and intellectual creation designed to think outside of the universal racial 'Negro' box. But you will find few people who hew to those disciplines of the 60s today.

In that regard 'black' is a rather blurry term. Back in 91, Asante provided something quite useful in his own way, because when he arrived on the scene, one could clearly make distinctions between his Afrocentrics and those who were not. For him to step up from that platform and make prescriptions for a broader set of (generically demographic) African Americans, is a stretch.

African Americans do not have the luxury of being able to demand that people see 'black' and actually know what they are supposed to be seeing. We have to hew to specific philosophies, religions and political ideologies just like everybody else. Again, this is why I find it problematic for people who claim to be something other than 'black conservatives' prescribe owing to some supervening defintion of 'black'. That definition cannot be sustained. It will never be capital B Black again.

Thrasher said...

There willalways be a capital B Black ethos in America in part because our genius has created so much of America from the labor to the arts..

The 60's experience was an overt movement yet Black have always been a major part of the country's entire being and landscape..

The "Negro" was a creation of the paradigm of the authors who were white and as such it was always lacking..

Black has always been an intellectual and cultural construct it's creation was not done via a parade nor welcomed..

It's luster is always in peril by white culture and of course the role of the Black Conservative/Apologist who could not handled the very idea of something as rightous and progressive as"Black is Beautiful'

Thrasher said...

During college we had Black Aides in the dorms this movement who then morphed to Minority Aides..This deductive development was championed by the white administration but also by the other people of color who were envious and did not know how to create thier own narrative so they piggy backed on our body of work at our expense..

It was a brillant idea by the white ruling class that was butress by the lack of courage and ethos of other people of color...The Black ethos is always in peril in America..

Cobb said...

RAs? Man I thought you were a Kappa. At least you look like one.

Thrasher said...

No Black Aides...Actually I was a scroller..lol,lol,lol..Our line was legendary..

Thrasher said...

I was so pleased when my son selected Howard to attend..I knew local colleges MSU, UM were so lacking in the capital B experience of late..

Plantsmantx said...

'Black' of course was originally that sort of cultural and intellectual creation designed to think outside of the universal racial 'Negro' box. But you will find few people who hew to those disciplines of the 60s today.

Even in the Sixties, I don't think people "hewed to the disciplines" to the extent you seem to think they did. "Black" may have been designed to achieve a certain thing by the people who popularized it, but as usual, most people took what they felt they could truly use, and left the rest. Maybe you have the impression you do because they tended not to condemn the rest, or even criticize it that much.

But hold up- well, I guess I need to tell myself to hold up, and ask myself why I'm even responding to your line of argument, lol. When I said "black" in my previous comment, I didn't mean "black" as opposed to "negro". I simply meant that in these peoples' minds, "black" naturally deserves to be judged harshly. It was as true in 1940 as it was in 1970, and as true as it is now. It doesn't really have anything to do with some backlash over what happened in the Sixties and Seventies.

Constructive Feedback said...

Question: Why can't Black people be considered "RACISTS"?

Progressive Answer: Because we do not have the POWER to impose our racial biases upon another group, suppressing them in the process.

QUESTION for Mr DeVega - Just for grins if we assume that there are about 4 Million "Dastardly Black Conservatives" (of voting age) walking around as automotons for their "White Conservative Masters"..........with them lacking:

* Elective Offices
* Credibility and Respect among the bastions of Black Progressives

and with the entire Black Progressive Machine blocking them at every turn - WHY is it that you promote this Black Conservative into an EQUAL position as is the Black Progressive-Fundamentalist that has control over ALL of the institutional seats of power WITHIN the Black community where Black folks have the final say of who will represent them?

Is the Black Conservative proportionally more POTENT than his Black Progressive-Fundamentalist counterpart?

Constructive Feedback said...

The question itself fails to detail the realities of certain people's consciousness:

1) Some people earn their STRIPES from the claimed "racial victomology" that they transact upon.

1a) A Black Conservative who DENIES being impacted by RACISM is called a scoundrel because he tries to "turn over the cart"

1b) A Black Progressive-Fundamentalist who OVER-REPRESENTS the impact of racism in his failure won't EVER be called out by his contemporaries. They transact off of the indictment


2) It is quite ironic that RACISM is promoted as the main blunt instrument that derails the interests of Black America while those who do the analysis routinely look past the SUCCESS that they have made per the channels of expression of POWER which were chosen.

That failed "Mission Accomplished" city is said to be a victim of the RACISM of "Corporate Abandonment", yet, for some reason those who rose to power, intent on bringing these unsavory agents of CAPITALISM down to size can't seem to voice for those of us that are observing - the extent that their particular ideology has played in the said downfall as they were one of the parties at the seat of the negitiatining table.

The real question, again, is NOT "Is the hated Black Conservative a victim of RACISM" from the White Conservative?".

One question along the way must be "Does the White Liberal Snarling Fox Joint-Venture Partner have any RACISM within him? Or is it not worth severing the voting partnership by expressing it as the Black man VOTES in a manner that is pleasing to him".

Those who are students of RACISM and who believe that ones respective IDEOLOGY serves as a container for it ultimately deserve to be continuiously played.

He'll never get around to asking himself if he is building us suffient INDEPENENCE OF CONSCIOUSNESS which will mitigate the harm that he is exposed to due to RACISM.

chaunceydevega said...

@Abstentus. Your posts on Cain are spot on. I forgot about Sowell's Black Redneck book. I am going to post an interview from that a few other Black Conservatives so we can have a hearty laugh.

@Plants. You mean dr. king wasn't a black conservative! How dare you blaspheme!

@Constructive. I was going to ignore you, but I must say that you need to get the name of the late great Dr. Marable out of your mouth and your half-cooked frameworks. For those unfamiliar check out Constructive's home base.

Let the brother rest before you start including him in your models...made more tacky by the fact that he passed only a few days ago.

Abstentus said...

Thanks Chauncey. We might be going against the dominant, mass cultural, socio-political zeitgiest (and unfortunately that is coddling, or at least tacitly condoning sorta-racists, but not really the worst of the breed,) but somebody's got to hold the line on the flank. I'm game. (I'm Cape Verdian on both sides. I'm mixed basically, so I know race is a bullshit construct, but racism is as much a part of American Society as the broth is part of the soup.)

And this cause is not hopeless. Way I have been saying it for a couple years at least, is that what is happening in the USA now is the last hurrah, the last gasps of white racist hegemony here. And them sonsabitches are not going to go out quietly or with out a fight.

Them bastids are going out ugly, like (some body play the Godwin card on me, I don't fraking care)retreating Nazi Waffen SS troops, cowardly running from the Allies, but raping and killing all the easy targets they can, on the retreat route.

Ya. That's what I said, and stand by it.

Plantsmantx said...

"QUESTION for Mr DeVega - Just for grins if we assume that there are about 4 Million"

Why 4 million? What makes you think there are 4 million?

Cobb said...

P. I'm not sure I get your import, but what I would say is that of course I agree that most people did not hew to any disciplined definition of Black. The vanguards didn't agree, c.f. Bunchy Carter as one egregious example. But that didn't change the fact that movement from Negro to Black was disciplined and very important. AND that the entire idea of 'black leaders' was part and parcel of movement politics and the concepts of unity still being hawked to this day.

I say there is no need for any special black political leadership and all such politics are derivative holdovers from another era.

Voluminously Yours said...

What anecdote were you referencing when you mentioned Foucault?

Abstentus said...

Re the Black question?

Personally I have argued that blackness (or what ever predecessor sociological term acceptable to the COLLECTIVE "US") is really about the group identity, as being a member of the group. I have specifically argued this against black outliers, aka black conservatives.

Peeps can't go around rejecting the group identity, by points of interest, and then claim continuing membership in the group.

That's some messed up stuff, condemning and insulting the vast majority of the sociological group and then claiming kinship with group when it's convienent to play the victim card. That's some messed up shit, according to my view.

Then again, I took 12 credit of Soch at my Public Ivy U. And having gone there, that means I can NEVER be a member of the AA Aristocracy. I can live with that though.

I'm still chicken shit about any thing too far south of the Mason Dixon Line. I lived in Balmer for 3 years, and learned my lesson in the first 3 weeks, truth be told.

Cobb said...

Can of worms. I'm not going there.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]you need to get the name of the late great Dr. Marable out of your mouth and your half-cooked frameworks[/quote]

Mr DeVega:

I have just finished watching 'Democracy Now' and their tribute to Manning Marable.

Who other than Michael Eric Dyson (and the guy from Black Commentator) is more qualified to give a tribute AND tell of Prof Marable's Marxist/Progressive resume?

You see Mr DeVega - I accuse you, more than anything else, as being a part of an "IDEOLOGICAL ENFORCEMENT GROUP".

This post is NOT about "Black Conservatives" from the stand point of any material THREAT that we are to you.

This post is about your own ideological intolerance and your (and Mr Thrasher's) inability to align the shortcomings that remain (or have intensified) after your "Mission Accomplishment".

You see - I am not sure that you all understand the difference between moving forward on a PLAN that is defined with DIMENSIONS per your own scope of visions VERSUS investing due time in understanding YOURSELF and your nutritional needs and then building up to your desired outcomes at a cellular level, replicating these cellular units AND THEIR SUCCESS.

In the boil the ocean approach that you seek - you seek to EXPAND in order to cover the deficiencies in the space that you now control. (The most significant of this space is between the two ears of your followers).

Funny how my "frameworks" always seem to come up short to your measure.

Oh Crap said...

@Cobb

I think you'll find, if you look, an interesting story behind every celebrity black conservative. Herman Cain, I don't know his. But I would guess one thing - then again, it's my own perspective as CD alludes. Black American conservatives that I know almost always have some economic factor that distinguishes them from the average socio-economic stereotype of the black voter.

The thing that tickles me the most about Black cons is they think they are something new, novel, and *special*, then complain when no one but those who hate us regard you that way. The economic interest you describe is not unique to Black cons (you know, the ones so DESPERATE to distance themselves from stereotypes.)

For all that preaching you all do about "personal responsibility" and "individualism", you sure are quick to lump everyone else into a pile.

I doubt anyone here thinks Black cons don't have any interesting stories to tell, but do any of you ever consider anyone's personal narratives besides your own?

Do you think you are the only middle class and middle class aspirant Black people in the world?

(The questions are rhetorical. We already know the answer.)

These are reasons why we laugh at conservatives' anxieties.

Oh Crap said...

@Congested Faceplant

This post is NOT about "Black Conservatives" from the stand point of any material THREAT that we are to you.

How can anyone feel threatened by Black conservatives when one is too busy laughing at them?

Thrasher said...

CF,

I don't pity you but I do regard the ignorance and underdevlopment of Black conservatives as being lethal and obstacles to the evolution of folks who have cultural dna's like myself and others..

Your willingness to be an agent for the interests of a culture which has been destructive to my mortality and morbidity in this nation poses a serious concern which I must confront and not dismiss..

What should I do about Black Conservatives in the post racial Obama era in a decaying empire?

Instead of viewing you as an adversary I am going to position use as a unit of capitial which is presently unproductive and a liability..

I intend to take your unharkness genius and flip it to advane my agenda while augmenting your untap potential ..You will be my case study on how to make a negro into a Black man without changing the name on your birth certificate all for under a dollar with a money back refund satisfaction guaranteed my brother..