tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post4860035751814200671..comments2024-03-17T20:04:18.872-05:00Comments on Indomitable | The online home of Chauncey DeVega: Michael Dyson Versus Cornel West is Not Boxing, It is Professional WrestlingLady Zora, Chauncey DeVega, and Gordon Gartrellehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09138154899923808806noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-54472449791103227612015-04-23T16:46:27.952-05:002015-04-23T16:46:27.952-05:00Nah, it's wrestling. ;)Nah, it's wrestling. ;)kokaneehttp://www.byebyedemocracy.org/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-25808066601873425192015-04-23T11:31:24.553-05:002015-04-23T11:31:24.553-05:00I suppose the “pointless” aspect of my comment ref...I suppose the “pointless” aspect of my comment referred to the public airing of Dyson’s grievances. To me his grievances are deeply personal, but along with everything else in our Western Civilization, he is going to try and capitalize and thing-ify his personal grievance for gain.<br /><br />More specifically, it seems as though he believes that achieving the level of prophet is the penultimate designation for someone with adequate wisdom, body of scholarship, as well as access to, and acceptance by power. To me Dyson’s words read as if he himself aspires to the level of his prescribed prophet, and that he believes West is short-cutting the process that Dyson believes he understands so well, and may even himself deserve. Could it be that the student is attempting to surpass the master? And that West’s occupancy as a self-prescribed prophet is getting in the way of Dyson’s? Moreover that West’s attacks on Dyson are threatening his attempt at achieving prophet status? Or maybe Dyson’s just pissed.<br /><br />But it appears as more than Dyson just being angry. One reading, mine, is that Dyson is attempting to usurp West’s position, not through what Dyson describes as necessary to be a prophet (wisdom, body of work, access to power), but by publicly diminishing West’s contributions and current relationship with academia, Black America, and those in power.<br /><br />So is all of this pointless? I suppose not if we are indulging Dyson. I guess I’m choosing not to indulge in his personal grievance, so perceive his vast article lambasting West’s entire contribution as pointless.SWnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-82573386779140743682015-04-23T07:58:24.212-05:002015-04-23T07:58:24.212-05:00For sure. Seeing West and Dyson cut wrestling sty...For sure. Seeing West and Dyson cut wrestling style promos would really kick things up a notch.Werner Herzog's Bearnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-17896877313624931292015-04-23T04:16:10.438-05:002015-04-23T04:16:10.438-05:00Cornel is going to come out so strong that Dyson i...Cornel is going to come out so strong that Dyson is going to be stunned. Cornel is the master. Dyson is the heir. This is some epic Hulk Hogan vs. Andre stuff. The whole show is gonna be amazing. Again, does Joe Q. Public get what is happening?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-14334400275967148252015-04-23T04:14:32.095-05:002015-04-23T04:14:32.095-05:00Great comment. The timing is very curious is it no...Great comment. The timing is very curious is it not?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-64985178467522883632015-04-23T04:13:50.786-05:002015-04-23T04:13:50.786-05:00The fight is the national tour, the C-Span shows, ...The fight is the national tour, the C-Span shows, the debate in the public sphere about the essence of "black authenticity". This is going to be epic. Do you think the audience gets the bigger picture?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-69505107371133136652015-04-23T04:12:44.844-05:002015-04-23T04:12:44.844-05:00How? Why?How? Why?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-70938204045447135882015-04-23T04:12:34.501-05:002015-04-23T04:12:34.501-05:00Is it? Please do share?Is it? Please do share?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-50449617596194977162015-04-23T04:12:24.156-05:002015-04-23T04:12:24.156-05:00You are using the boxing fighting lingo. Is is tha...You are using the boxing fighting lingo. Is is that obvious?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-68153778827259083682015-04-23T04:12:06.359-05:002015-04-23T04:12:06.359-05:00This is big big money. All the players involved kn...This is big big money. All the players involved know it. Millions?chauncey devegahttp://wearerespectablenegroes.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-74824077991837508992015-04-22T12:56:23.301-05:002015-04-22T12:56:23.301-05:00The day after the Dyson article dropped a colleagu...The day after the Dyson article dropped a colleague of mine was pretty adamant at the wrong-headedness of the boxing metaphor. At the time I was thinking she was right, but that there was another better metaphor out there, but one I couldn't grasp. I think you hit the nail on the head.Werner Herzog's Bearnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-75107726319847013422015-04-22T12:44:16.911-05:002015-04-22T12:44:16.911-05:00as opposed to the white purity self professed prog...as opposed to the white purity self professed progressives.<br /><br />two peas in a pod7thangelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-11534897992162029972015-04-21T20:48:20.293-05:002015-04-21T20:48:20.293-05:00Content goes to West. Demeanor and poise go to Dys...Content goes to West. Demeanor and poise go to Dyson.<br /><br />The possible beginnings of the feud:<br />http://m.democracynow.org/stories/13241 (skip to 42:40)<br /><br />http://m.democracynow.org/stories/13092<br />(MED vs. Glen Ford)<br />kokaneehttp://www.byebyedemocracy.org/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-75807675284249247522015-04-21T19:39:56.596-05:002015-04-21T19:39:56.596-05:00The whole thing is repulsive.The whole thing is repulsive.Michael Varian Dalynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-58830135306192145652015-04-21T18:20:15.346-05:002015-04-21T18:20:15.346-05:00It's always sad to see people you hold in some...It's always sad to see people you hold in some level of esteem publicly feud in such a personal, dirt-dishing manner. If, Zirin theorizes, this is akin to pre fight hype, then what's "the fight"? Is it about something I used to call, "the only black syndrome" where in this case who is the unparalleled go to black intellectual? Damn.<br /><br />It really doesn't matter who "the left" calls on in the run up to 2016 to inoculate them. Dyson has been called on far more than West, and that's not necessarily anything to be proud of, though it's made him some money. In those canned and scripted formats, they seem far more comfortable with Dyson. West is prone to not follow the script. Good for him.<br /><br />Lastly, these brothers are laudable in their own right, but King vs Malcolm this ain't.Gable1111noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-7717501586865323182015-04-21T15:40:16.167-05:002015-04-21T15:40:16.167-05:00Who among the potential 2016 AA voters are listeni...Who among the potential 2016 AA voters are listening to this sideshow? This is the build-up to a MAJOR payday for the AA elite dialing for political dollars. I decline to be drawn into a "blacker than thou" contest between 2 men I once respected.<br />I've learned enough, at age 61, about our history and the old battles for the "Soul of Black Folks" that was the tiff between BT Washington and DuBois to recognize that each had a contribution to be proud of and each made, in hindsight, shameful mistakes Such is life and the human condition. <br />Take what you find useful. Share the best ideas with friends and family, And, vote for those who are working toward your interests.<br />It will be interesting to see if a new crop of AA political leaders emerge in anticipation of the money train that is the 2016 Presidential Election. Considering the leading candidates for the job, I'm not inspired at all and only look forward, with disgust, to more Repuclican congressional antics based on shocking insults and twitter apologies aimed at the most dubious Clinton Monarchy. Let the show begin...!!!<br />On another note: What EXACTLY is Sen. Warren's record on Civil Rights. I'd like to know before she is drafted by the liberal left to be the (2016 VP running mate) Dutchess of Clintonland.<br />Oh, Brother...!!!Black Sci-Finoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-86997870492687717392015-04-21T13:10:17.515-05:002015-04-21T13:10:17.515-05:00...and who is Dyson tapdancing for (at the moment)......and who is Dyson tapdancing for (at the moment)? The white <i>neo</i>liberals?Plantsmantxnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-72238268429392151142015-04-21T12:06:10.474-05:002015-04-21T12:06:10.474-05:00West's bravado painfully reminds Dyson that he...West's bravado painfully reminds Dyson that he must self censor in order to maintain his lofty pulpit on MSNBC. West's showmanship effectively communicates his formidable body of scholarship. www.cspan.org/video/?234747joe manningnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-43623812875881202642015-04-21T08:22:16.305-05:002015-04-21T08:22:16.305-05:00*West and Dyson will feud today. This will put a b...*West and Dyson will feud today. This will put a butt every 18 inches in a seat. West and Dyson will reconcile and sell it as a story about two lions and titans in the Black Prophetic Tradition who love justice and "The People" so much that they had to duel in order to place their ideas in a fiery crucible as a way of reducing their brilliance down to its essence.*<br />*Public jawing is West's and Dyson's way of applying black intellectual power to Plato's Theory of the Forms.*<br /><br />:D<br /><br />Though I must say that West's bombastic tirade against Dyson (and Sharpton and other Democratic party apologists) is rooted in calling out their obsequiousness in lining up with Democratic party rubric du jour, whereas Dyson is taking it more personal, more banal, attack on West's intelligence & integrity. Though to be fair, West, I guess, by calling Dyson a sellout is just as personal.azspotnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-57113078446695664.post-26120729444336498692015-04-21T08:10:49.993-05:002015-04-21T08:10:49.993-05:00Speaking of "what the drums are saying"....Speaking of "what the drums are saying"...to me, "black intellectuals" are like "black leaders". My "race music" detectors go off when people are slotted into the "black XYZ" ghettos, or assigned some representational role that people in other populations are not. "Step 2" to that process is a hermetic sealing of interests: containment into the zoo of "special interests".<br />Both Dyson and West are academics who - admirably - have devoted much of their lives to the study of the effects of racism in America. It would be wonderful if more academics grasped this thorn (regardless of their degree of melanin), since race/ism is a Frankenstein of the "white" population, terrorising the "black" population.<br />I stopped taking anything Dyson says very seriously the 99th time I saw him on MSNBC, or heard him on NPR, rapping for the nice "white" people like Bill Bojangles in a 1983 beatbox timeloop. Because that's what "black intellectuals" authentically do: they rap. My sense is that Mr. Dyson took to his cage a little too well.<br />Cornell West, on the other hand: say what you like about him, but he has maintained a ferocious integrity, and a refusal to tap dance for any audience. Cornell West has refused to stay in a cage. <br />It's ironic that Dyson critiques West for showboating, while Dyson is the one who performs "blackness" for "white" audiences and Power (within all its established limits) with most zeal.balitwilightnoreply@blogger.com